(English translation of the original interview, which is located at https://www.tortillaconsal.com/bitacora/node/3105)
Foreign Minister Moncada attended the conference in Caracas, Venezuela on the 200th anniversary of the Monroe Doctrine. See Nicaragua’s Message to the International Forum against Imperialism, Fascism and Neocolonialism
“The OAS is the political-diplomatic instrument designed by the United States”
December 2, 2023
JG [Jorge Gestoso]: We are accompanied by the Chancellor of Nicaragua, Mr. Denis Moncada: Mr. Chancellor, thank you for being with us.
Denis Moncada: Thank you, Jorge, and a cordial greeting to the audience.
JG: Mr. Chancellor, 200 years of the Monroe Doctrine, you are here in Caracas, you participated in that event. Did the Monroe Doctrine die, or is it still alive and well?
Denis Moncada: No. It is still operating, but it is in a process of weakening, to the extent that our people, our governments, are advancing in this fight against Imperialism, against fascism, against neocolonialism. The Monroe Doctrine, which has been the instrument of North American Imperialism, is declining, as is the hegemonism of the Empire.
JG: Also for those who see us and are not familiar with what the Monroe Doctrine is. A President of the United States, on November 23, 1823, James Monroe says: “America for the Americans,” and there is a double interpretation. What is he saying? If Americans are all of us who inhabit the American Continent, or when you live in the United States, do Americans refer to themselves as Americans? I mean, what was he saying? America for US Americans, or America for Americans; or both? In reality, what does experience tell you? What was it for all those born in the American Continent, or was it “America for US Americans”?
Denis Moncada: America for the US Americans, that was the conception of the North American Empire, and it was the objective of the Monroe Doctrine, really the control, the domination of the Americans, of the North American Empire, because we must differentiate between the people and the North American government. The objective was to conquer America, dominate America, seize its natural resources, and expand the geography of the North American Empire.
JG: If there is any country that can be a very clear example of what it has had to live with in matters of the Monroe Doctrine, it has been your country, Nicaragua, which has been the protagonist of a war where the presence of the Monroe Doctrine was present.
Denis Moncada: It has been permanently present, with the cycles of history and the political, economic and social struggle of Nicaragua. The Monroe Doctrine, in the case of Nicaragua, has been present since it originated, until today; and the struggle of the Nicaraguan people at the time led by Sandino and later by the Sandinista National Liberation Front, which is currently led by Commander Daniel, we continue in that anti-imperialist struggle, because Imperialism does not stop carrying out its policy of aggression, invasion, of interference, of taking over the natural resources of our countries south of the Rio Grande.
JG: Is there a relationship between the “Contra” and the Monroe Doctrine?
Denis Moncada: The Counterrevolution was an organization financed, organized and trained by the United States. They tried to put an end to the revolutionary process of Nicaragua that was organized by the Sandinista National Liberation Front, vanguard of the Nicaraguan people, which is the actor from the Sandinista Popular Revolution, which we continue in that process.
JG: And the logistics, the structure of the Contras were in the neighboring countries, were they also, in some way, complicit in “the Monroe Doctrine”?
Denis Moncada: That’s how it was. Part of that had to do with the Organization of American States, precisely. So, the United States always uses its vassals, its subject countries, to serve as a territorial base, on the one hand, and also to mobilize the weapons of the Counterrevolution at that time and serve as a support base at that time against Nicaragua, against the government of the Sandinista National Liberation Front.
JG: Among the things that History shows is that the Palmerola air base in Honduras is classified as the landing beach, like the United States aircraft carrier in Central America. Do you agree with that definition?
Denis Moncada: Palmerola is definitely still there in Honduras. Palmerola was the transit point when President Zelaya was overthrown, and it was also a supply base for the counterrevolution in Nicaragua. It is the spearhead in intervention and military presence, of military bases, of the multiple military bases that exist in Latin America, including South America.
JG: And how does the OAS play in all this?
Denis Moncada: The OAS is the political-diplomatic instrument that the United States designed, which it located, remember, a few blocks from the White House, the State Department, to precisely put into practice that policy of domination, interference and invasion, and to have an apparent political-diplomatic justification in America and the rest of the world, in the face of North American aggression against countries in Latin America.
JG: Nicaragua left the OAS, why?
Denis Moncada: We left precisely on November 19, we already resigned, we no longer have ties with the Organization of American States, because precisely we came to the conviction that this is the Organization of North American interference and intervention and that it does its work permanent against the peoples that have democratic governments, that have truly free governments.
JG: Now the question is, today, specifically, how is it in some way present, or interfering, or making itself felt that this Monroe Doctrine is being lived within Nicaraguan territory?
Denis Moncada: Due to the permanent pressures from the United States and some European Powers; the arbitrary unilateral measures, illegal, also inhumane, and the offensive policies, of aggression, of tendencies towards destruction, to paralyze a democratic, popular, participatory government, such as the government of Nicaragua, the Government of the Sandinista National Liberation Front.
JG: Day by day the idea of multilateralism advances, so much so that you have seen that the BRICS, which in principle were five countries, by its initials, Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa, has now expanded to six more countries. Now there are 11, and we are already talking about two African countries, for example. The topic: Is Central America interested, is it interested, does it want to participate in the BRICS?
Denis Moncada: The peoples are also carrying out universal transformation with their struggle, and all that hegemonism that the Empires have maintained until now is in decline, and the peoples are interested, active and moving precisely to create a Multipolar World, a truly free, independent, fair, respectful world in relations between states and governments.
In Central America, Nicaragua has raised the interest and supports the organization and creation and expansion of the BRICS, as part of this struggle of the countries in the world to change the situation of injustice and aggression of the Empires that the world, humanity, is currently experiencing.
JG: Geopolitically, Nicaragua is in a key place if a second canal is to be built, something like the Nicaraguan version of the Panama Canal, but is it encountering resistance?
Denis Moncada: There has always been resistance. Even historically, the United States forced Nicaragua, at a time of military occupation, to sign a treaty in which it granted them the right of 100 extendable years to build that canal.
With the Revolution that ended because that treaty was repealed, and we continue, Nicaragua continues to conceive its sovereignty and its decision to build a canal and make the arrangements, cooperation and investments with the friendly countries to build that interoceanic highway.
JG: China has expressed, or at least one Chinese citizen has expressed, his great interest and has projected a certain proposal to build that canal. Where are we there?
Denis Moncada: We are in the prefeasibility studies, especially related to the Great Lake of Nicaragua, which is a very important area of fresh water and which must be taken care of in terms of its environment, its natural resources.
We are working, our government is always open and cooperative as well, relations with China right now are excellent relations; and also open to investment from other countries in the construction of a canal, which is a right and is a sovereign exercise of Nicaragua.
JG: Is the Monroe Doctrine trying to sabotage the progress of this project?
Denis Moncada: That is what the fight is. If the Monroe Doctrine is defined for the control and domination of the United States, which has not only been applied in Latin America, but has spread throughout the world, then, Nicaragua with the Sandinista Government strengthens and continues to establish and make sovereignty and national dignity prevail.
JG: Now, there is one thing that is absolutely verifiable. You have serious problems when it comes to organizing elections – which, from the Monroe Doctrine, is about discrediting, putting the spanner in the wheel, so that the entire electoral process of Nicaragua is complicated internally and discredited internationally. It has been happening to you systematically.
Denis Moncada: We have a very clear Constitution and laws. Nicaragua really has no problems holding elections; They try and try to interfere from abroad, especially with negative propaganda. There the fight continues, that is, Bolívar’s fight against fascism, against precisely the Monroe Doctrine, continues, and Sandino’s fight continues.
We really say, we have a clear and precise Constitution and laws so that the electoral processes, with the legally constituted political parties, develop their policy and their aspiration for the candidacies they wish, complying with the Nicaraguan institutionality.
JG: What would you say, in a very simple way, have been the greatest achievements of Sandinismo?
Denis Moncada: Freedom, ending a dictatorship that was precisely part of the extension of the Monroe Doctrine by the North American Government; freedom, direct participatory democracy, with the participation of the Nicaraguan People; the programs and economic projects that we are developing; the fight against poverty; equity and equality that advances; the education system; free universal health; the construction of infrastructure; the foreign policy of friendship and cooperation, promoting investments of interest to Nicaragua.
In short, a world in which what we are seeking is the common good of the Nicaraguan people and friendship and the international relations of mutual respect with all states and governments.
JG: You were participating in this forum here in Caracas about these 200 years of the Monroe Doctrine. There were participants from numerous countries, so tell us how it has been experienced that this becomes something not only regional, but goes beyond borders.
Denis Moncada: Of course, very important, because in addition to all the struggles on the political, economic, social, and cultural order, you have a meeting point in this case in Caracas.
200 Years after the Monroe Doctrine, we must reflect on what it has been, what it tries to continue to be, and where it must be paralyzed; where, the unity, the integration of our peoples in the different organizational, political, union, intellectual, academic, journalistic fields, analyzing, exposing and refreshing that fight Bolívar began against Monroism as well, which in Nicaragua was continued by Sandino; Martí, in short, so many heroes and leaders of Our America. And there is a point of reflection.
We meet to continue the fight, in all possible ways, clarifying ourselves about this aggressive policy, of intervention, of interference, of blatant theft of the natural resources of our people, and how we really must continue with this process of struggle that is weakening the imperial hegemonism of the United States, the United Kingdom and other European Powers.
JG: From an economic point of view, the fact that the sanctions do not seem to do as much damage as at some other times, they were apparently part of the Monroe Doctrine. Do you see that new channels have been developed for countries that have been victims of the Monroe Doctrine so that they can trade, that they can establish financial relations, and that in some way they weaken the impact that the sanctions had had until now?
Denis Moncada: Of course, because all countries in the face of aggression and in the face of those measures that do cause harm, and it must be made clear, do cause harm, but the countries resist and look for a way to overcome these arbitrary, unilateral, illegal measures, to overcome situations and continue moving forward.
So, it is part of the defense and the organization, the cooperation, the creation of BRICS, the expansion of BRICS and other organizations, the Movement of Non-Aligned Countries as well, the ALBA countries for example, CELAC. So, we are looking for how to join forces, integrate, and fight together, to defeat these imperial, really fascist, and neocolonialist measures.
JG: You were talking about CELAC, about multilateral organizations… Is Nicaragua supporting, is Nicaragua betting on integration?
Denis Moncada: Yes, we are a country with a vision and a mentality of unity and Integration, Central American, Latin American; That is why we are part of CELAC, we are part of ALBA, we are part of SICA [Central American Integration System]. And it is a fight, because we are clear that within that policy, precisely of the United States, the Monroe Policy is aimed at dividing, fractioning, avoiding the unity and integration of countries in a fight to defend their own interests and your free and sovereign life.
JG: In other words, we are still in that fight that on the one hand we have those, do you remember? the Lima Group, whose objective was to overthrow President Maduro and, in some way, dismantle any attempt at integration.
The Lima Group died due to its own negligence, then we have seen advances with presidents, like President Ortega, like President Lula, like President Petro, like President Andrés Manuel López Obrador, like several Latin American Countries. However, the Lima Group wants to begin again with version 2.0 of the Lima Group. Do you see any kind of progress, or are we still in this struggle, that the Monroe Doctrine continues trying to sabotage Integration?
Denis Moncada: They are groups of ephemeral life due to their content, the objectives for which they have been created, because they are unfair, they go against the interests of the peoples of Latin America, the struggle of free peoples seeking their second Independence. This also obstructs and stops these types of organisms.
It is part of the fight, they are going to continue, the United States, the United Kingdom, other European Powers, are going to continue creating organizations, mechanisms, to divide unity and Integration in Latin America. And we, the people of our hemisphere, of our continents, have to be clear that this is the objective of the powers, divide and conquer, and look for how to strengthen unity, cohesion and the common struggle.
JG: In the particular case of Venezuela… Venezuela continues to fight to recover that territory of Essequibo that never stopped belonging to it. Is it a clear manifestation of sovereignty, of reaffirming sovereignty?
Denis Moncada: Of course, Nicaragua has expressed, and we reiterate right now, at this moment, its support for Venezuela in the defense of its sovereignty, its territorial integrity, and Essequibo. Because the vast majority of countries have had experience of how the United States at a certain time has appropriated, or the United Kingdom, or some European powers have appropriated our territories, to later convert them as wedges, as pieces to divide, to create contradictions between the people, and they come out advantageous.
JG: Now, the issue is, what should we do better so that this integration advances at the pace we need? Because the speeches are very nice, but.… For example, CELAC does not have an institution, it does not have regulations, it is not like the European Union which has statutes. What to do to move forward?
Denis Moncada: Will, vision, decision, for the benefit of our population. The European Union may have its structure, in Latin America there are no conditions to create a structure like the European Union, we have to be careful because it is a tendency of Europeans to try to reissue their structure in America, which may not necessarily be beneficial for unity and Latin American integration.
JG: There is a topic that is recurring throughout Latin America, and it is the topic of migration. When you live in a country that is “from the First World,” be it the United States or the European Union, our migrants arrive in those countries and become demonized, and the problem of migration begins the moment the Latin American migrant enters their border.
Nothing is known, if you live in those countries, what have been the conditions that have forced you, commercial conditions, even political, religious conditions, for that migrant to have to leave the country. What is the situation and what is the position regarding migration on the issue of Nicaragua?
Denis Moncada: In Nicaragua, migration has been gradually decreasing. Because part of the structural causes of migration, in almost the entire world, including Central America and Latin America, are precisely situations of extreme poverty in the countries, of insecurity, of organized crime and drug activity, of injustice and inequality.
In Nicaragua we have a policy that seeks and is aimed at the common good. They are social policies aimed at our people, that is, to end this policy of exclusion by neoliberalism, by historical capitalism. So we are strengthening our economic, social, health, and food security policies, so that our population in Nicaragua has the natural environment that we all should have in our countries. To live in our countries with dignity, and ensuring all the basic needs of the population.
JG: Do you remember Pablo Escobar, who said: “Either silver or lead”; “either I buy you or I kill you”? And in many Central American countries that are, let’s say, the path, the route to the North in what has to do with drugs, with drug trafficking. Their institutions are contaminated by that force. How does Nicaragua counteract that?
Denis Moncada: Let us remember that drug trafficking and organized crime is also an expression of the Monroe Doctrine and North American policy and that of other countries; Their very organisms are contaminated and are the main promoters, organizers and transporters of the drug. That must be clear.
So, they create conditions, they are also responsible for situations such as the existence, in some countries and in many cities, of the presence of drug activity, of organized crime, many times almost as a form of government, as an expression of power in those places.
In Nicaragua, fortunately, we have a very positive, very advanced Security System that is explained in a few words by the existence of institutions such as the Police and the Army that are very responsible, very professional, with moral and ethical values. And a population that values the sense of security, and contributes and participates in a leading way with our Institutions. A country where there are no bases, there are no runways where the ships that transport drugs can land, there are no organizations, organized cartels in the country. So we maintain a fairly active and positive Security Policy.
JG: The Catholic Church in Nicaragua… friend?
Denis Moncada: You asked a very strange question, what happens is that in Nicaragua we really have the institutionality and we have a lot of respect for the preferential option that citizens have with respect to religion. We are very respectful about it.
JG: But in my question I go one step further. In the history of Nicaragua, the Catholic Church has not been neutral and has not necessarily been a friend of Sandinism. Or am I wrong?
Denis Moncada: Just remember that the Catholic Church is the cross and the sword with which they conquered us since the old days of the initial original colonization. So, you have an expression of political power and religious power. In the case of the country, like Nicaragua, we have a legal Institutionality, the state exists and religion exists and religions have their respect.
JG: I repeat, friend or not friend of Sandinism, historically, the Church?
Denis Moncada: Some leading sectors of the Catholic Church are adverse, they really are adverse and carry out a policy of interference, and aggressive, as happened in 2018 with the attempted Coup d’état that our population managed to control. There was a very direct participation of sectors of the Catholic Church, violating the Constitution and the law of Nicaragua, probably even violating its own mission, which is more ethical, moral and religious than political in nature. There are other sectors that are really respectful of the Institutionality.
JG: Chancellor Denis Moncada:, thank you very much for being with us.
Denis Moncada: Thank you very much, Jorge, and cordial greetings, it is a pleasure to see you again in person after so long.
JG: The pleasure is ours.